Alhaji Abdulahi Yelwa was a former Commissioner in Kebbi State and a member of the National Political Reform Conference of 2005 to 2006. He was in the team of PDP leaders who drafted former President Olusegun Obasanjo to contest the 1999 Presidential  elections. He is currently the Publisher of Abuja-based The Great Republic newspapers. In this interview with Group Politics Editor, TAIWO ADISA, he gave insight into the widespread campaign for zoning  among Northern politicians, the Jonathan Presidency and other political issues. Excerpts:

A strong debate has been ongoing about 2011, as regards whether President jonathan should contest or not. You are one of the leaders of the North, how do you take the debate?
It’s true that there is a debate going on about the PDP zoning arrangement, which we all know is a gentleman’s agreement reached by major political allies of then President Olusegun Obasanjo. To many of us at the time, the arrangement actually was like a coup against Nigerians who were not satisfied with Obasanjo’s first tenure, who desperately needed a replacement and could have come from either North or South. But if you look at the attendance at the caucus meeting, these are people who were allies of Obasanjo at the time and who were convinced he deserved a second term and that arrangement was reached.

Another reason for reaching that arrangement is that there was no consensus between the political actors in the North. Don’t forget that until a day to the PDP convention of 2003, Atiku was undecided on whether or not he should run against Obasanjo. So, there was no consensus among the key Northern leaders who had political ambition at the time. Now, if you look at zoning on it’s own, it’s not necessarily a bad thing. There is no country where a form of zoning does not take place. I can assure you that in America for instance, it is not going to be likely anytime soon for the President and the Vice President to be both female. In all societies, you find some kind of accommodation that is reached to ensure that a large majority of the citizenry agree and feel represented.

But the problem we have in Nigeria today is that zoning has not been made a constitutional item. PDP had 10 years to make zoning a constitutional matter, but it decided to keep it as a gentleman’s agreement, which it can change from time to time and I agree with this idea of leaving it as a tool for looking at it’s own political realities and advantages, and for it(PDP) to use it to continue to maintain the status quo, if that is what the Nigerian electorate want. So, nobody will deny the fact that zoning is not a constitutional arrangement, even though you can find traces of zoning in certain constitutional sections, like the Federal Character principle which indirectly talks about zoning because it ensures certain level of representation for each of the groups that make up the country.

So, we must agree that for now, the Constitution of the Federal Republic of Nigeria has given every Nigerian the right to run for any political office, as long as he satisfies the qualifications enshrined in the Constitution.

The understanding of many people is that the zoning arrangement started in 1999?
Well, zoning may have started in 1998 / 1999…but don’t forget that actually, it was the NPN that introduced zoning in the days of Shagari. But for this dispensation, it started with Obasanjo and you know the details. It was a realization on the part of Northern politicians that power must revolve to the South, in compensation for the unlawful cancellation of the June 12 election, which late MKO Abiola had won but was cancelled by the military government. It was that realization in August 1998 that the then G34 decided that power should revolve to the South. This is how it came about and it has been a system that we practised, whether or not we agree that it is being practised.

So far, the Northern elders being led by General Ibrahim Babangida,  and former Vice President  Atiku Abubakar are championing this cause. How do you see their agitation?
I have no problem against people who are proposing zoning because we are in politics for competitive advantage. If it is through zoning that they can achieve their goals, I have no problem with that. But what I would wish to hear from proponents of zoning is to suggest practical ways of dealing with the constitutional reality. Obasanjo did not impose zoning on the North. He negotiated it. So, anybody who thinks it is only through zoning that he can achieve his goals must set up the process of negotiation. But I don’t want the North to be seen to be undemocratic because you cannot justify telling the President for instance that he can’t run, when the Constitution of the Federal Republic of Nigeria guarantees his right to run. So, this must be made clear. But if it is only through zoning that they can make themselves relevant in the current dispensation, then so be it. But those of us who believe that the constitution is clear on this matter will also maintain their position.

Do you believe that the president should run?
I believe that the question is for the President to decide. If you want me to give conditions, I can. If the President can, for instance, solve the problem of crime in Nigeria, if the President can address within the time he has the problem of public corruption, if the President can find a way of making our Governors more accountable to the people; if he can for instance address the problem of mass poverty, especially in Northern Nigeria, if he can address the problem of graduate unemployment and falling standard of education; If he can address some of these critical issues facing Nigeria today, I will have no problem endorsing him for whatever term the constitution allows for him.

The question some people will raise is that time is short and he doesn’t even have up to one year before elections will come up. So, what time frame does he have to achieve all of these?
He can honestly begin to address some of these issues. Some of them may not take forever to achieve. I know it’s not going to be easy to get these things sorted out, but an honest attempt on his part to start addressing some of these issues will convince Nigerians that he actually deserves to be given the opportunity to continue and I believe the time he has is good enough for him to start laying the basic foundations. For instance, what he did recently with the Nigerian Football Association, this is a good attempt because we cannot continue to keep our sporting development in a manner that shows we are not a serious people. If stopping Nigeria from all competitions for the next two years is what is required to build a tradition of sports in Nigeria, so be it. Again, the issue of mass poverty can be addressed because the mechanisms are there. The institutions are there. It’s just that they are not being properly enforced. So, it can be done and he has the time to do it. The appointment of the INEC Chairman for instance which most Nigerians have commended, this is an indication that the President has a plan to conduct a free and fair election. Anyone who knows anything about election knows it’s not for one person – Jega or for the President to conduct. Nigerians must decide if they want a free and fair election and when they do, they will conduct one.

One of the issues people have also raised concerning the argument about zoning is that Obasanjo seems to have kept to the arrangement in 2007 when he ensured that power shifted to the North. But by a stroke of fate, power reverted to the South. Does that justify the fact that the North can retain power till 2015?
That is assuming that the North gets it by 2011. Obviously, if that is the arrangement, then it means power can only be held not by constitutional method but by this gentleman’s agreement till 2015. But don’t forget that whoever comes after 2011 deserves a two-term tenure that is guaranteed him by the Constitution. So, you will see that zoning will continue to create problems for our polity until something more concrete is done about it.

The pro-Jonathan rally of Bauchi State recently, is believed to be the mindset of the young elements in the North
I think it would be foolhardy to deny that it wasn’t a legitimate movement. There by might be some pushing from here and there, but I can tell you that there is a debate going on in the North and it has been ongoing since 2003. Northerners, especially Northern professionals are asking serious questions about the way and manner Northern leaders have managed Northern hegemony, so to speak and many are not convinced about this insistence on a Northern President, especially when the Northern presidency is not accompanied by a Northern agenda. It is not just enough to have a Northerner in Aso Rock, when some of our basic issues remain untreated. Don’t forget we did not have a Southerner as President before we dealt with the issue of Niger Delta and nothing could have been more critical to the Niger Deltans than the resolution of the militancy. So, if President Jonathan could address the massive problem of poverty in the North, which our Governors appear not to appreciate; if he has a way of addressing critical issues that have afflicted the societies of the North, a lot of Northerners would have no problem about who sits on that chair.

So what exactly is the Northern agenda?
Northern agenda is nothing more than looking at the critical social issues that have been afflicting the North which have remained unresolved. At independence, the North was an agrarian society. Agriculture was the mainstay of our economy. Today, agriculture has been reduced to the back burner of policies of government. Secondly, we have dealt with the problem of illiteracy. But today, education in the North is the worst you can find anywhere in the country. We have problem of mass poverty which was in a way controlled during colonial rule and early independence because agriculture was absorbing most of the employable population of the nation.

Looking at the champions of the zoning cause, are they actually representing the intentions of the Northern political class?
When you talk of Northern political class, you have to be careful because there is no homogenous Northern political class. There is an evolving system and I can assure you that anybody who understands the working of the north knows that there is a problem of unity in the North, most of them based on personal interest. These people who are championing the zoning arrangement, some of them have political agendas; some of them want to be President and supporting zoning is the only way to make it easier for them, as it was done in 1999 which made it easier for Obasanjo to emerge. So, zoning may be their own way of getting political advantage. But I can assure you that what the North wants about zoning system or any system for that matter is the system that addresses their immediate concerns. If zoning can do it, so be it. But they want a system that can deal with these basic issues. Most of our leaders are detached from the down trodden. They have a system of paraphernalia that does not allow the ordinary people to get to them and those around them don’t tell them the truth about what is going on.

The problem other people have identified is that these leaders seem to have their way almost all the time in the North, particularly when it comes to directing people to follow a certain path. Are things changing?
Things have been changing. It’s just that we have not sat down to study them. I can assure you that you cannot simply as a leader now tell the North what to do. I think it’s about time leaders come down to know from the ordinary Northerners what is it that they want and not what the leaders want for them. Any leader who understands and appreciates that will go a long way. But if you think you can be an arm chair leader by using your newspaper image to say you can speak for the North, you will be surprised.

You were talking about the possibility of younger elements in the North backing Jonathan to run in 2011. But the leaders who are visible have continued to say no Jonathan in 2011. if Jonathan eventually comes out to say he wants to contest, do you foresee a gang-up by these leaders to frustrate him?
Let’s look at the political reality of time. One of the Governors I read in the papers mentioned that the PDP is a reality in our polity. It is not going to perish overnight and it will not be in anybody’s interest for the party to perish, whether or not you are in the opposition. So, PDP has its own dynamics. It has its own processes of identifying and selecting it’s candidates and there is a numerical reality about it. When the PDP Governors decide who they want as the party’s flag bearer in 2011, I can assure you that they will have their way because they already have the numbers. You must hold a convention and a contest must be held for a winner to emerge. We know that these delegates, especially the so-called delegates are in the hands of the Governors because they are appointees of the Governors. This is how the PDP system is designed. So,I cannot see any protest because political protest must be channeled through a process. You cannot say that if the party imposes Mr. A, then we will leave. Unfortunately, there is no party to go to.

There is the ANPP and AC…
Well, you know more about the destiny of the ANPP than I do because you probably would have also watched its rise and fall. The nine months we have before election is not enough to put together a party that can seriously challenge the PDP and this is the reality. I would wish our leaders concentrate in developing opposition. There is a history to be made there. If all of us cannot be President, let all of us dedicate our lives to sustaining opposition because this is what may save our democracy in the long run. For the proponents of zoning, I would wish they look inwards; what is the position of zoning in many states of the North? I know for instance my Senatorial area. One emirate has held that position since 1999 and the position did not revolve to other emirates as required by the zoning philosophy. You go to some states you find that certain positions have been held by certain people in one zone without anybody agitating for that position to be zoned. So, those of them who are now insisting on zoning must ask themselves how much of that zoning exists in their states.

This is where I think the challenge should go. Let the politicians go back and operate the principle of zoning in our own localities. In some states of the North, only Niger State has attempted to revolve the governorship. The former Governor is NUPE and now Babangida is from the Minna side. Maybe the next time it will be Gwari. But most other states don’t care about this zoning arrangement because it is hypocritical, looking at this way for this insistence on zoning when we cannot advocate zoning in the states where we emerged.

Some people are saying that since Jonathan is already hampered by constitutional time frame and he can only be sworn in twice, which leaves him with only one more term of four years in office. Should that not automatically give the area where he comes from an edge to complete their own zoning that term from 2011?
Some argued that way, but don’t forget this situation was not created by deliberate act of political engineering. It was a divine intervention and I have written extensively on this. When I was at the National Political Reform Conference, I also made this view known. If we are serious about North-South power division, especially in the presidential ticket, then we must have mechanisms for ensuring continuity for whatever region power is said to belong to and you can do that by a system of multiple Vice President. If we had that system of two Vice President in place when Yar’Adua died, the one from the North would have moved in to complete Yar’Adua’s tenure and this would have been just, constitutional and fair to the area you have given presidential power. But when you have a system where the President is from one region and the Vice is from another and the Constitution says when the president for whatever reason is not able to perform his duties, the Vice takes over and before that, you had promised the region that they would have power for eight years, how then do you reconcile this? SO, if this is what we want, let us make constitutional provisions that will guarantee for whatever zone that period of years that we say power has been zoned to it.