Chief Edwin Kiagbodo Clark is a household name in Nigeria, particularly in the South-South region. The former information minister was a senator in the Second Republic and one of the few surviving nationalists in the country.  In this interview with DONALD OJOGO, REGIONAL EDITOR (SOUTH-SOUTH&EAST), the elder statesman spoke on a wide range of national issues. Excerpts.

Can you give an unbiased assessment of the performance of President Jonathan?
You are not fair to me by asking me about the performance of the president. It is just like asking me to write the testimony of my son. I am not in the position to do that because I will be accused of being biased. All that I can say is that Nigerians voted for him, nothing like that has happened before. So, Nigerians expect so much from him and, therefore, he has a greater burden than many people. He should be able to respond to some of these problems.

Do you think he is responding to these problems?
He is responding. Again, let us clear one thing; the president was sworn in just only on May 29, 2011. 

Are you not aware that he started a year before then?
That one was a trying period, a transitional one. That period cannot be judged because there were so many people who believed that Jonathan ought not to be there. But when Nigerians finally agreed to vote for him, it is now that he is an elected president of Nigeria and, therefore, he should be able to satisfy them with what he promised them. He said there would be no more lamentation; he has about three more years to go and I believe that he will perform. He is a responsive president; he listens to people; he is not arrogant; he is not dictatorial; he is incorruptible and those fine qualities should not be regarded as signs of weakness.  As far as I am concerned, given the necessary support which they gave him when he was elected, he will succeed. I appeal to Nigerians to be patient. The pertinent question is where were these Nigerians when some of these past leaders looted the treasury and sold some strategic national assets?

Are you aware that many Nigerians are of the view that the country is drifting and they are becoming impatient with President Jonathan, especially because of his failure to tackle security challenges? They are saying the president is failing and that the country is not progressing under his presidency, do you see sense in what they are saying?
That is not true, the country is not drifting. That is unfair and I am accusing you press people. Where was that opinion poll taken? The country is not drifting. Is it because of the mere fact that we have Boko Haram in one part of the country? It is not in the whole country; it is not even in the entire North. This is not the first time; we had the Maitasine; we have the Niger Delta militancy and we have kidnapping in the East. This thing will soon be a thing of the past; the country is not drifting.

What is your reaction to the claims in some quarters that President Jonathan does not have the capacity to lead, to continue in this assignment?
Who are those to hold the view on whether the president has the capacity to lead the country? They have no right to hold such views. He has the capacity. What is capacity? Is it because he has no capacity to steal or to be fraudulent or to be corrupt as quite a number of people have done in the past? He has the capacity to perform. He is a graduate; a man who has a doctorate degree he is physically strong and mentally fit and more, importantly, he is incorruptible. Give him time, he would perform. These are mere prejudices and people who are using the press to harass him will soon be disappointed. The president is capable of performing and he is performing.

But as I said, he has more to do because Nigerians expect so much from him by voting him to power and their expectations should not be misplaced.

Is it true that the South-South is getting more than a fair share from the presidency of this country?
That is ridiculous. There are some newspapers (I don’t want to mention names) who believed that Jonathan has awarded contracts in the South-South more than he has awarded to other parts of Nigeria. That is not true. You must have listened to me recently when I cried out that the president, being president of Nigeria, does not mean that the people of the South-South should be forgotten. He should not leave us where others left us. There is nothing that is happening in the South-South apart from the training of ex-militants; there is nothing that is happening in the South-South that is special to the South-South. A few things have been done for the whole country and the South-South is part of the country.  South-South is not being specially treated and that is why I said the other day that people have the impression that the Niger Delta Ministry has been created, because the Niger Delta Development Commission (NDDC) is there, all the money goes to these two areas. The money voted for the Niger Delta Ministry is not more than what is voted for other ministries and to saddle the Niger Delta Ministry with the construction of the East-West road makes it a nonsense.

Every year, the East-West road takes about two-third of the budget of the ministry.  What remains for other developments? There are no houses and there is no post-amnesty programme in the South-South. But we are not complaining because   the president belongs to the entire Nigeria and once the security issue is done away with, he would be able to perform. He has more than three more years to go and the sins of Nigeria, the failures of the previous governments in Nigeria should not be visited on a man, who has just taken the office. Give him time, he will perform; he is just a victim of failed governments in the past. 

Are you saying that some elements are trying to destabilise him?
Oh yes, they are. They even said if Jonathan wins, they would make Nigeria ungovernable for him. They are still in Nigeria. But they will fail. I know that Boko Haram, if it started as a religious organisation, has been infiltrated by politicians who want to destabilise Jonathan’s government. It is politicians plotting to destabilise the government and not a religious group or ethnicity. Boko Haram has been infiltrated by unpatriotic politicians who believe that they alone have the right to rule Nigeria.

What does the alleged plot against President Jonathan by these faceless people portends for the country?
It is sacrilegious; it is unpatriotic and it is treasonable for anybody who is not elected by the people of Nigeria, who has not received the blessing of the entire Nigeria to try to destabilise a properly elected government. So, Nigerians should resist them because the president they have elected should be given a free hand to rule this country.  That is what we want.

How do you think the Jonathan administration is capable of tackling the daunting security challenges confronting the country?
The security organisations should be reorganised; they should be looked into, overhauled and people who are dedicated should be put in place to deal with the security situation. I do not think that the situation is more than what security people, if they are well-equipped and well-staffed, will not be able to deal with. All that is required is for the president and his government to have the political willpower to deal with the situation. Before the Christmas Day bombings, there were warnings; if these warnings were taken seriously by the security forces particularly the police, some of these things should not have happened.  It is not above the government. When there was serious kidnapping in the South-East, the president rose up to the situation and today kidnapping in the East has become a thing of the past though we still have isolated cases.  

Many Nigerians are of the view that the issue of Boko Haram has overwhelmed the Federal Government to the extent that the last Independence Day celebration was observed in  Aso Rock because of the threat by the group to bomb the Eagle Square in Abuja. Do you share this view?
That is nonsense; absolute nonsense that Boko Haram has overwhelmed the president. Boko Haram has not. I think the press has not been fair to the president; the press has not been fair to this government; they decide to magnify little things. Independence Day celebrations cannot be the same every year.  The 50th Anniversary of Nigeria was celebrated in a grand style at the same Eagle Square by the Federal Government, despite the fact that Boko Haram was in existence at the time. A 51st birthday like in the life of a human being is usually a low key event. People celebrate their 40th birthday, 50th birthday, 60th birthday, 70th birthday and so forth. That we did not celebrate 51st birthday is no big deal; there is no show about it. And it is ridiculous and insulting for anybody to suggest that a whole president ran into Aso Rock to take cover; that he could not go to the Eagle Square because of Boko Haram, that is arrant nonsense.

Were you not aware of the threat by Boko Haram few days to the Independence Day?
Boko Haram’s threat has always been there. Everyday, they issue threats. They threatened to bomb hotels, Eagle Square,  Aso Rock and so forth.  The president is still in Aso Rock.  So, I do not think the threat by Boko Haram to bomb the Eagle Square counted for anything because the president was going to have a low-key celebration. It is not true that the president was overwhelmed by Boko Haram.  He will will take care of them. All his government needs is the political willpower to deal with those who are behind the sect. They may be faceless but people are behind them. But I am appealing to them that in the interest of this country, they should lay down their arms unconditionally. And I am also appealing to Christians not to retaliate because that is what the politicians who are behind Boko Haram want. They want a situation whereby there will be problem between the Christians and the Muslims and as the Sultan of Sokoto puts it, there is no problem between Muslims and Christians. Let Nigerians be patient. It is not a matter for the Federal Government alone, everybody must be involved in solving the security challenges facing the country. The governors of the North particularly should be more involved. 

How can you accuse the press of magnifying the activities of Boko Haram, a group that bombed the police headquarters, United Nations building in Abuja and killed over 40 persons on  Christmas Day? How do you see that as the creation of the media?
I am not talking about the incident of Christmas Day alone. Over the period, the press has been magnifying and reporting Boko Haram attacks without offering suggestions as to what should be done. The press has been portraying the government in a very bad light. I agree that the bombing on the Christmas Day was factual, it happened. I am not saying the press should not report, but the press should report some of these things responsibly.  The press is part of this country. What I am saying is that the press and the people of Nigeria should all be patriotic. We should not emphasise things that what will create problems for the people of this country than will bring something that is good for them. The press should emphasise good things about the government at times, which is what I am saying. All I am saying is that there is need for the press to examine issues objectively and professionally.

You would recall when a few years ago, terrorists attacked various places in London, including the Underground and killed over 200 people, including a Nigerian; the British media did not create panic in London but reported the incident patriotically.  The British media did not accuse the government of inefficiency or weakness. The press was supportive of government’s efforts to address the challenges. Similarly, the 911 episode in America brought all Americans, including the press together and nobody blamed President Bush and labelled him a weakling.  You can recall that all Americans, including members of the forth estate of the realm, came together to fight the enemies of government and were united in the search for the way forward.

Do you join the people that are advocating that with the security situation in the country, there is a compelling need for the president to sack the service chiefs and Inspector General of Police particularly when you said the security agencies should be overhauled?
No. when I say overhaul, I mean you can overhaul services without removing people, either by way of providing more equipment and re-organising the place; it does not imply that the service chiefs should be dismissed or should be sacked, but if any one of them is found wanting, by not acting proactively or by not fashioning out intelligence reports to assist the government to act firmly, he has no place in the service. Nigeria first, before those individuals.  When we talk of overhauling, it can be changing of personnel from place to place, movement of personnel from place to place, getting more information gathering gadgets and so forth, that is what I mean by overhauling. It does not mean people should be removed from their positions.  But when there is need for removal, they should do so in the interest of the whole country.

Are you satisfied that the government, which also claimed to know some prominent citizens behind Boko Haram, has not unmasked them?  Do you not consider this as a sign of weakness?
Government is not weak. I disagree with you.  If the government is saying there are some big guns behind what is happening, government is giving them time to change; government is giving them time to be nationalistic; government is giving them time to be part of this government.  It is not a sign of weakness. They should be able to compare Jonathan with other people. Jonathan is a civilized and decent young man, who believes that everybody is equal in Nigeria, who believes in persuasion, not dictatorial antics.

One thing we should bear in mind is that those who are being killed by Boko Haram are Nigerians and the people who are also being killed on Boko Haram’s side are also Nigerians. This is the balance being drawn by the government, that we do not want a lot of bloodshed in Nigeria. That is why I appeal to them to drop their guns unconditionally. There is nothing anybody can do to overwhelm Nigeria; no religious body, whether Muslim or Christian can overwhelm Nigeria. Nigeria is a secular state and it will remain one. As for those high profile politicians who have been identified by the government and have refused to change, the Federal Government should have the political willpower to deal with them because Nigeria is greater than any individual and the government has the duty to protect the citizens and their property.  

Do you nurse the same fears with the President of the Christian Association of Nigeria, Pastor Ayo Oritsejafor, who has raised the alarm that the activities of Boko Haram could lead to a religious war?
I do not nurse the same fear because I believe majority of Moslems are right-thinking people; they believe in the existence of a united Nigeria. I also believe that majority of Christians are Nigerians who also believe in the existence of one united Nigeria and that the two religions can live side by side. So, if there are few evils as the Sultan mentioned, the devils are in the minority and they cannot overwhelm Nigeria. So, I am not thinking that this situation can lead to any religious war and I am appealing to Christians and Moslems alike that nothing like religious war should be declared.  The people who are perpetuating the evil will be rounded up and dealt with by the government and that is why they should think of the larger interest of Nigeria and not their personal interest. There will be no religious war in Nigeria and government has a duty to prevent that and Nigerian leaders, senior citizens like us should appeal to our people and speak out so that there should be no religious or any type of war at all in Nigeria.

Do you support the view in some quarters that the Boko Haram insurgency was encouraged by the amnesty granted the ex-militants in the Niger Delta and the current post-amnesty programmes being enjoyed by the ex-fighters in the region?
No. That is not true because Boko Haram has been in existence before the administration of Jonathan.  You would remember that even in 2009 when the leader of Boko Haram,  Muhammed Yusuf, was killed, at that time amnesty has not been granted to militants in the Niger Delta. So, there is no correlation between the two. They are two different issues.

Are you satisfied with the pace of the post-amnesty programme in the Niger Delta?
I am satisfied with the prevailing peace in the region. Today, Nigeria is exporting over 2.5 millions barrels of crude oil every day. It was about 700 barrels per day during the crisis. There is no more kidnapping in the creeks. If there are, they are very few and they are being done by criminals and not by freedom fighters. And I believe this will continue and I am appealing to the Federal Government that the post-amnesty programmes should be pursued objectively, so that the boys who fought with zeal would be happy to see their environment transformed. That is what we want. So, it will happen.